Then Came You

[nowmedical]

So now I've got my B&O (with Gyro SE record deck) up and running for a few months now, I'm going back through my vinyl to see how it all sounds now I'm middle-aged.

So I turn to "Then Came You" - a terrific album by someone called Dionne Warwicke. Every one of the 10 tracks is fine - no fillers at all. Try "Move Me No Mountain" or "Sure Thing"... and the bridge in "It's Magic" is candy: Oh, I'm on a mystery ride... so in love with you...

That leaves two questions that only my colleagues-in-the-ether on this website can answer:

1 why on earth did she add an E to her name?
2 who was Jerry Ragovoy? Seems a songwriting genius to me.

[BachtoBacharach]

Jerry RagovoyFrom Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaJump to: navigation, search
Jordan "Jerry" Ragovoy (born 1935, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania[1]) is an American songwriter and record producer.

His best-known composition "Time Is on My Side" (written under the pseudonym of Norman Meade) was made famous by The Rolling Stones, although it had been recorded earlier by Kai Winding and Irma Thomas. Ragovoy also wrote "Stay With Me", which was originally recorded by Lorraine Ellison and performed by Mary J. Blige at the 49th Grammy Awards.

An important behind-the-scenes force of East Coast soul music, Ragovoy wrote or co-wrote several classic New York and Philadelphia soul records in the 1960s, often distinguished by a conspicuous gospel feel.[2] The best of these included Garnet Mimms' "Cry Baby," Erma Franklin's "Piece of My Heart," Howard Tate's "Get It While You Can," all later covered by Janis Joplin, plus "Time Is on My Side" and "Stay With Me."[2] Ragovoy also contributed to first-class soul records as a producer and arranger.[2]

Ragavoy met Dionne in 1962 or 1963 when she sang the background vocals for Cry Baby. They go back a long way. Then Came You is a great album...an underappreciated classic.

As far as that infamous "e" Warwick added that in 1971 at the urging of Linda Goodman who was a psychic astrologist famous for the book "Sun Signs"; she had a huge celebrity following including Ronald and Nancy Regan among others. She also dabbled in Numerology. Warwick was a follower and in 1971, Goodman recommended that Warwick add a small "e" to the end of her name to balance the "vibration" of her name and recognize her spouse William Elliott (rumors abounded that Elliott was a womanizer and Warwick confirms this in her autobiography). Goodman also convinced Warwick that the small e would bring her even more success. Goodman was dead wrong. Although Warwick left Scepter in July 1971 and signed with Warner Brothers for a contract valued at over $5 million (a staggering amount for a singer and the highest contract ever offered a female singer at the time ...keep in mind that during this time, most actors on the very top were getting about 1 million per film) , her career quickly went south; in 1970 the top female singer in the world based upon album and single sales to two years later, not being able to get a single charted. Her marriage to Elliott soured and ended in divorce, Bacharach-David left her without any notice, and she began to have vocal cord node problems. The only bright spot during those years was that she was selling out venues wherever she went. She finally dropped that "e" in 1975 but her fortunes took a long time to improve. She blames "that damn e" but there were many factors. One factor was her reliance on psychics, etc which was a fad in the 1960s and 1970s and another was tampering with her name or her brand...not a good idea to basically squander the success the name Warwick was attached to. Warwick has always been a sort of a flake about such things so the Psychic Friends Network period which cost her a tremendous amount of credibility was really nothing new....Warwick was ridiculed by many for that "e" including many friends like Leslie Uggams, and family like Cissy Houston and the PFN was not a surprise although she should have figured out that a loss of credibility would result; the money spoke to her very, very loudly, more loudly than her credibility. But, you can't buy groceries with credibility (or more to the point, maintain the lavish lifestyle she was used to). Warwick is a trouper though and her ability to stay in a state of denial has kept her plugging away.

[gillanddon]

Shame BachtoBacharach you always give Dionne Warwick such a bashing!! Is it something personal?

[BachtoBacharach]

Nothing personal, just the facts. Sorry if you are offended.

[gillanddon]

It is difficult to read the rather scornful tone you adopt when you write about parts of her life which she was probably struggling with .. marriage, children, career etc. Like us all. Is it a failure adding an 'e' temporarily to the end her name? This unforgiving scrutiny on a personal level is really too much! Why not concentrate on the success aspects .. the fabulous songs (more than most). Yes and that fabulous 'Then Came You' album.

[BachtoBacharach]

I am sorry that you find my posts difficult to read. You may ignore them if you like or rebut them or respond in any manner you choose. I will continue to post my opinions here and again, I am sorry if that offends you.

[An Enormous BB Fan]

I really like BachtoBacharach's post. Always have, too. He is always very informative. I hope he stays here for a long time. Whether it's Dionne, or Burt, or Hal, or whoever... I want to know the unvarnished truth about their lives and careers. Just focussing on the upside and successes of our hero's lives does not give us the full picture.

[gillanddon]

Okay! Sorry to have got all hot under the collar here. I too enjoy all the discussion too and appreciate all your detailed knowledge Burt to Bacharach and others on this subject. So please don't stop! It is exciting the new Dionne release today and a new one from Burt (and Ronan Keating) I think next week!!

[BachtoBacharach]

Thank you all for your interest in my posts. Dionne is not a dull, boring person; most assume she is because of the persona she has cultivated for public consumption. She is full of "piss and vinegar" as the old-timers say and always has been and it's definitely refreshing to see Dionne not play things so safely. It's not often we get to see celebrities unmasked. It's a good thing that Dionne is allowing herself to be seen in a different light, as unflattering as it is. And, this Dionne we are seeing on Celebrity Apprentice isn't cardboard and fake! I do admire her for putting herself out there, warts and all.

[gillanddon]

Yes I agree .. as uncomfortable as it is!! I remember seeing that tough side of her in London sometime in the early 70's .. absolutely fabulous concert but she was angry with the orchestra for playing a flat note .. it was a freezing cold night .. and she stopped the song three times .. stood staring at these terrified chaps for what seemed like an eternity and then proceeded! On another subject, I wonder if she will still go ahead with her concerts in Tokyo next week?

[maestrofan]

Re: The album "Then Came You" (one of the 5 released by Ms. Warwick during her Warner Brothers years) Although the title track was never one of my favorites, the remaining 9 co-written by Jerry Ragovoy are terrific - my favorites being "Getting In My Way" and "Move Me No Mountain" (both were performed in Ms. Warwick's mid 70's concerts). Other favorites are "It's Magic" and "Sure Thing". Unfortunately it was released some time after the Billboard #1 title track and it was not the commercial success it might have or should have been!

Sadly Ms. Warwick's "tough side" is really more like her "nasty side" which I have personally observed many many times over the years. I too have seen her stare down her accompanying musicians, threaten a spotlight operator by telling him he'll never work that venue again and chastise her audience when she had voice problems and ended a concert after 2 songs (tickets were refunded). Although Ms.Warwick frequently flaunts her religious beliefs, she clearly does not always follow the "golden rule" ie. treating others in the same manner she wishes to be treated. No doubt Ms. Warwick is a very generous person - take a look at her charitable activities - it's just sad that this other side of her tends to bite the hands of those that have fed her through the years.

[BachtoBacharach]

Warwick's "nasty side" has been on display with fans before...I recall a 1970 concert in Chicago when Warwick was at the height of her fame...she was being interviewed by a local reporter and was running late for a concert...there were 9500 people waiting to see her and she was to take the stage at 8:15 after the Constellations opened. Well, Warwick was so engrossed in the interview, promoting her new record company among other things, and when she was cued to the stage, she actually finished the interview, and when she was cued on again, she proceeded to remark to the interviewer "Hell, they can wait." She was booed when she finally appeared almost 30 minutes past the time she was scheduled. She was not fazed in the least and proceeded to give a great concert and redeemed herself. The interviewer reported her remarks. Warwick has been known to be dismissive of her fans at times and sometimes it made the press. In a 1977 show in Florida, well past the height of her fame, she still filled a showroom with about 2500 folks who were treated to a show one reviewer described as so detached and self-involved that he questioned how Warwick had achieved such great fame while at times not connecting with the audience as she had not for that show. He even when on to say that Warwick was "disturbing" and seemed to be singing to herself. When Dionne is "on" in a concert there is no one who can touch her...when she's off, she's really off. I love her music and she's the most talented pop singer perhaps ever, but she's not a nice person...everything is all about Dionne...a professional friend of mine said she was a classic narcissist. LOVE her music but sometimes don't like her.

Now to put her fame and ability to fill arenas and venues in perspective, even Aretha was not even filling those same venues. In Miami in 1971, she and Elvis Presley were the only two acts to sell out a large venue there of 6,000 seats...others such as Aretha, the Fifth Dimension, and many others had unsold tickets. Dionne played all types of venues from college gyms and stages, to arenas, night clubs and halls. Paul Cantor was her manager and he got her booked into venues and on television that many other female singers during that time could only dream about. At the Newport Jazz Festival in 1968 she attracted the largest audience ever attending there and in 1971 at the Festival, she attracted a crowd estimated at about 22,000. That show (and the festival) ended for many years when a riot broke out outside the stage and audience enclosure while Dionne was singing What the World Needs Now; the non-paying crowd waiting outside, pissed because they were being removed from the premises by the police, stormed the gate and Warwick was shuffled off-stage. She was big, big, big, but somehow, at some point she lost repsect. She is not considered in the same league as Aretha is these days...ironic becuase she was as popular as Aretha was back in the day!

[gillanddon]

Dear BachtoBacharach .. thank you so much for that. It all makes sense and ties in with the concert I saw in the 70's. It's almost a case of .. if the audience doesn't inspire her she sort of gives up on them. instead of what should be the other way round!! I've noticed Whitney can also become very introspective etc whilst performing as well. The song Dionne was singing at the time was Stevie Wonder's 'All is Fair in Love' and I think she wanted it to be absolutely note perfect and the poor bloke from the London Symphony Orchestra hit the bum note!?!

[BachtoBacharach]

Stevie Wonder's All In Love Is Fair is one of the tunes she sang frequently in the 1970s and she did just about the best interpretation of the tune ever done...her performances were so nuanced and you could tell she FELT the song. She's a legend, it's true, but there's a lot of baggage along with that. Aretha has a lot of baggage too, and has been described at times as a diva with capital D! I just can't quite put my finger on why the public has been so forgiving of Aretha and less so of Dionne unless it's that Dionne's lapses have been so public and larger than life ( the "e", PFN, charity scandal, pot bust, tax problems, etc). I love Aretha but feel that she is somewhat overrated as a singer and that Dionne is very underrated.

[maestrofan]

BachtoBacharach:

I believe the 1970 concert in Chicago you're referring to is one that I attended as well at The Civic Opera House. That was a couple of years before Ms. Warwick moved to Warner Brothers. Although she kept us waiting she did redeem herself with a great performance which included her just released single "Let Me Go To Him". ......... A year or two earlier she appeared at Ravinia - an outdoor venue just north of Chicago with a covered stage along with a a couple hundred covered premium seats (thousands more were spread out on the lawn). A torrential thunderstorm occurred shortly after her opening number which resulted in an elevated ambient noise level caused by fans scrambling for shelter and the storm itself. Ms. Warwick didn't even acknowledge the storm - she just stopped singing and chastised the crowd for interfering with her ability to hear herself sing (standing there like a petulant child threatening to leave the stage). That lasted between 20 to 30 minutes and although she resumed singing Ms Warwick had clearly lost that audience - so many stating that it was the last time they'd be attending any of her concerts. The late great Chicago Sun Times columnist Irv Kupcinet commented on how she had admonished her fans that night and I don't believe he ever covered her again in his future columns.

I've often thought that if it wasn't for "those cigarettes" and that "attitude" - Ms. Warwick would still be a top drawer "A list" attraction with that great voice still intact and a huge fan base playing at "major venues" around the world instead of the hectic and tiring travel schedule she endures playing relatively small showrooms that comprise much of her itinerary today! I recall the days when a performance by Ms. Warwick was truly an "EVENT"