The Burt Bacharach Discussion Forum

Next one.
Why did the Carpenters not use the fabulous finishing run-out on Close to You?

Maybe Richard Carpenter wanted to put his own arranger's stamp on the piece...just a guess! Perhaps one of our music people on the listserve has a more definite answer.

Whenever I think I'm so smart about all things Burt, I think of the Carpenter's "Close To You". I think their version is one of the greatest pop songs of all time. But here's my point: I would have bet anything that Burt arranged that song. Because, as far as I'm concerned, it's a pure Burt arrangement. And, yet, he didn't arrange it. So I guess I have to say "shows what I know."

I remember watching a Carpenters documentary where Burt said...
"I missed the boat on that one (Close To You)......Richard nailed it !!!"

"Blue"

I think the first answer to your question was perfect. it was Richard's own "stamp"...there IS a kind of "run off" at the Carpenters ending...but
its the repeated phrase of "wah --ahh ahh ahh ahhh...close to you..."
this ending was more Beatlesque, (more "straightforward pop") than a soul singer improvising the ending, such as Dionne did on her album. I can't remember how Richard Chamberlin ended his version...but suspect he didn't muse phoenetically like Dionne did at the end....

Steveo

I suppose that when you are faced with an "instrument" with the qualities of Karen Carpenter's voice, you are going to find yourself inspired to use it in ways like Richard Carpenter did. Multitrack away until nirvana is reached and never mind the "original". Hell, make an "original" for yourself.

To my generation, that heard that version on the radio in the early 70s, the ending alone kinda transcends all previous versions of the song. In fact, we've been known to turn our backs and wail, "there IS no other version!!"

(Except for Isaac Hayes' ...)

heheheh, daddy dom!

Burt must have realized that Richard Carpenter was quite an arranger. Did Burt ever try to work with him again in any way? (Of course, why would he when the whole point was for Burt to write, arrange and produce his music himself.) Just curious though. If you don't ask, you never learn.

Hi Enormous, as the Carpenters recorded for A&M, also Burt's label, I am sure this web was woven quite tightly and each knew what the other was doing during that time - but who can tell us? I wonder what the fabulous Carpenters biopic tells us about that relationship. It's been a while since I've seen it.

Yep.

Another question: Why didn't Burt and Hal write a bunch of new songs for the fabulous Karen Carpenter? Or did they? Or were they conflicted about working with Karen because of their relationship with Dionne? My thinking is that after the incredible success of "Close To You" by the Carpenters, you would think that B&H would want to capitalize on that success, just as they had with Dionne after "Don't Make Me Over". And especially since they were all at A&M.

One other thought: Maybe Richard wanted to do the writing for he and his sister himself. And maybe Burt did bring new material to them, who knows?

having been on the scene down there at the time myself-Hollywood-A&M, etc....I wasn't aware of Burt writing any new material for the Carpenters...
Their seminal hit was taken from an old 1963 penned song..."Close To YOu"
re-arranged by Richard(with a lttle help from Herb Alpert, who
asked that they work up an arrangement on this tune with the privso that the little piano fill be included on the bridge...I think Herb felt that this would be "quite a hook" to the song (and he was right!)
Richard himself is a brilliant writer and arranger, and i think
leaned toward writing his own material, especially after they got going......
However, I'm only aware of a couple of Carpenter penned songs that were hits...
One was "Top of the World"...their must be a few others...anyone know?

Steveo

Well, they sure had something going for them, otherwise Tim Hardin wouldn't have written that song about wanting to be Karen and Richard's brother!

Completeeeeeeely off-thread now, but I think their version of "Desperado" is exceptional. If hell had frozen over, Karen's voice on the opening line would melt it right open again.